Formula 1 is one of Sander’s biggest passions, but also a topic that ties in together really well with business agility. Formula 1 teams need to do so much more than just being shown on tv. There is a whole process behind it, where hundreds of people work together to strive for a single goal; becoming the world champion.
Laurens Bonnema and Laila Nouijeh saw the same overlap Sander does, and created an entire talk around it. They’ve been doing this at large conferences like Agile 2019 and the AgilityMasters.com Meetup. Find you what you can do to Accelerate your Scrum Formula 1 style!
What you’ll discover in this show:
– Formula 1 teams break goals down into small, granular level improvements
– A race is like the Sprint Review; it is a display of all the work that has gone into it in the past time and now it’s time to elicit feedback
– Hundreds of people CAN work together on a single product
Mentor to leaders creating resilient organizations. I make boring business notes fun!
I am an Agile Trainer & Management Consultant and a mentor to leaders creating resilient organizations. I have a strong background in IT with experience in almost every role. I take great pride in my work, and it shows in the recommendations I have received over the years.
As a Certified Scrum Master, Professional Scrum Master, Certified Scrum Product Owner, Certified Agile Master, SAFe Program Consultant, Agile Master Assessor, IPMA Agile Assessor, and PRINCE2 Practitioner, I strive to merge classic and Agile management in the conviction that it is the future of professional management.
As a Professional Scrum Trainer and SAFe Program Consultant, I help to improve the profession of software delivery as well as marketing, human resources, and finance. I bring my experience in enterprise IT since 1999 and on Scrum Teams since 2006 to my teaching, am a driving force in the Agile community, and am a sought-after speaker at conferences and events.
Laïla is a Scrum Master with PGGM where she guides multiple IT teams. Her strong social skills, blistering honesty, and powerful drive enable her to motivate people and teams to max out their awesome. She is curious and inquisitive and continually looking for ways to improve herself and her teams.
Sander Dur (host)
Scrum Master, Agile Coach, trainer, and podcast host for ‘Mastering Agility”
Sander Dur is a business agility enthusiast, with a passion for people. Whether it’s healthy product development, agile leadership, measurement, or psychological safety, Sander has the drive to enable organizations to the best of their abilities. He is an avid article writer, working on a book about Scrum Mastery from the Trenches, and is connecting listeners with the most influential people in the industry.
Discord community: https://discord.gg/6YJamBJxUV
The life of a Bolt: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iptAkpqjtMQ
Support the show (https://www.patreon.com/masteringagility)
teams, formula, race, people, racing, lila, creating, bureaucracy, season, lawrence, fast, organizations, goals, sound, rules, detail, watching, passion, engines, point
Laila Nouijeh, Sander Dur, Laurens Bonnema
Sander Dur 00:00
Hey guys, welcome back to this week’s episode of the mastering agility podcast series. The series aims to inspire you and others by bringing in the best people in the business. My name is Sander dur, and I’m your host. Make sure to check out the show notes. To get the link to our Discord community. We’re building it. People like Martin DOMA and Lawrence Barnum and James complete have already joined. We’re trying to build a community that we can learn from each other that is going to help people develop more. But with this podcast from each other, like posting jobs, writing articles, you name it, we’re doing it over there. So feel free to join. We’d love to see you guys there. Then you guys know Formula One is a big passion of mine. And I’m definitely not the only one. Lawrence Barnum and Lila new Yep, founded are a lot of similarities between Formula One and Scrum and they created an entire talk and worked around it. They’ve been all around to work discussing this. Find out in today’s episode, what you can do to accelerate your scrum Formula One style. Never a dull moment like not was boredom. I just said after a lot of technical difficulties. Difficulties. We’re here with Lawrence with Lila, how are you guys doing at the end of the week?
Laurens Bonnema 01:18
Awesome. I’m actually having kind of fun because I’m seeing that I’m not the only one who has technical glitches every now and then. Because we got started here. And like last time we recorded and then it turned out we had the wrong mics. And now we’re recording and we have this interesting bug in the platform that I think it’s the first time I’m seeing it. I think it’s also the first time you saw it. Never essentially no audio, which for a podcast. Kind of sucks. Kindness. We’re here now. I had a wonderful week. A great day today. Lila
Laila Nouijeh 01:50
great in a busy week. So glad it’s weekend now. So I’m counting down to the can I get on the couch? Maybe pop open a bottle of beer.
Sander Dur 02:03
Yeah, lay down do nothing sounds like the perfect starting movie. Maybe watch some of the the Formula races or drive to survive. Yeah, which is coming out soon as well. And that’s going to be the topic of today’s podcast recording. You guys see the similarities between scrum between business agility, and Formula One. And you created an entire workshop around this? Uh, talk. You’ve done this in, in Washington, in Amsterdam in a lot of different places. Where did your passion come? From? What At what point did you start to figure out this is something that I really enjoy.
Laila Nouijeh 02:36
For me that’s, that’s a while ago, I think? Well, 20 plus year ago. So my, my boyfriend at the time was a huge Formula One fan. And so every Sunday with the race, he was just watching TV for about one, one hour and a half. And I was just sitting on the couch with him. Also looking at the TV, and after a couple of races. I also was hit by the Formula One fire since since that time, I’m I’m a huge fan. I’ve been to a couple of races.
Sander Dur 03:14
You remember what season it was?
Laila Nouijeh 03:16
I don’t know what was I think 94 I think 9394. Yes. And I think my
Laurens Bonnema 03:29
for me, it goes back even further. There’s there’s a there’s a big exception here. There’s always a bit because I watched Formula One with my dad when I was a little kid already. And I think so this probably a little under 40 years ago that I started watching it. However, it was just something I like to watch right. So when I studied I also watched it and I liked it enough to like be at home for when the race was showing and also stay up at night or when the race was showing and so pretty much a normal fan.
Laila Nouijeh 04:09
But I also started out as a normal fan Lawrence, everything can happen.
Laurens Bonnema 04:14
Lila is next. Lila is a next level Formula One fan. So when we were in Washington and Washington race there, then I saw what a true Formula One fan is and that she is one and that made me want to watch the Formula One races like with a different intensity. That’s what she taught me. I’m forever grateful because now there’s true parallels that I also see with that and other forms of high performance teaming. But that’s mostly thanks to welcome. credit her for
Sander Dur 04:45
that. She would like to be the new commentator for the Dutch national
Laila Nouijeh 04:49
that would be yes. A good commentator Yeah, people you know that Lauren’s ice cream a lot. Yeah. Race.
Laurens Bonnema 05:02
That’s that’s part of the fun. Yeah, the watching Lila watch a race is almost as exciting as watching the race itself.
Sander Dur 05:08
How do you guys feel the previous season? The 2021 season went down?
Laila Nouijeh 05:13
Yeah, it definitely.
Laurens Bonnema 05:14
I was screaming at the end. Yeah,
Sander Dur 05:18
absolutely. They’re still talking about there’s still an investigation going on. I’m really curious what’s gonna come out of that?
Laurens Bonnema 05:27
Yeah, what what I really liked was the remark made by the officials like this is it’s called racing. And I was like, yeah, yeah. Even though arguably, it may have been judged a little bit better, and maybe earlier even. Because there were some reasons to do that at the beginning of the race. Not that the end. But yeah, it’s, it felt more like racing last year, then in a couple of years before. And that’s what I really liked.
Sander Dur 05:53
Yeah, just like products, just like any other sport, if there are too many rules, too many boundaries, too. Too much overhead, or any other things, entities trying to pressure you down, put you into your back into your cave. It’s not gonna be that fun to watch it to be part of. And I think that’s what’s been going on the last couple of years as well.
Laurens Bonnema 06:14
Well, actually, in our research, but also looking into the parallels for high performance teaming in Formula One, it is one of the things that we highlight that Formula One does something really special with regards to the rules, they don’t make any excuses for them. So when there is a new constraint posed upon the teams, they innovate within those rules, those boundaries instead of whining about well, they also do whine about them. And especially if you, for example, listen, that is like next level, but then he gets into car and just racist the shit out of it. Right. So and that is sheer brilliance, because they complain, but they comply. Right? So it’s not that they let it there. They then still within those boundaries, race, like you wouldn’t believe. And that’s what I really liked. So no excuses, no, we’re here to win races, even under these
Sander Dur 07:11
Exactly. And that’s what I really appreciate about Hamilton. It’s really easy from my Dutch side to have an orange glasses on, and to just dismiss whatever he’s doing. But the sheer brilliance of him the consistency, the level of passion and commitment into it. I mean, both us was in the same car, he had the same level of machinery. And yet he is nowhere near the level of Lewis Hamilton also the way he took his defeat after the race after the last race, where I can imagine you’re so disgruntled by the way that it came down, he loses his eighth possibility to a championship in the absolute
Laila Nouijeh 07:50
Sander Dur 07:54
dominating the whole race. And yet still, at that point, being able to take a punch on the chin, still stand up straight and walk away. Like that is an amazing thing to do. I mean, I don’t even in my product teams, I don’t take people that see people taking it on the chin like that. Yeah. What What are for you the parallels that you found? Yeah.
Laurens Bonnema 08:30
Because this also what we do in the presentation, right, so I give like a leg up, and then Lila steps in with a vengeance. So let’s do the same thing. So the first thing that we found is like a crystal clear objective. And of course, when you see objective, everybody also starts thinking in the Agile Space key results. And that is, what they do in Formula One as well, or the prime directive course is to get faster. But not every team can do that in equal measure. And you see in different T in different teams, different objectives, and can also
Laila Nouijeh 08:59
reach real, isn’t it? Like you also have to have a reachable goals? Yeah. In the presentation, we talked about the example of the William steam. The ones show glorious. William steam is really suffering, the last couple of years and 2020 was, I think, one of the most saddest years for the for the team. And I think overall in the whole season, they came to qualifying to, I think 10 times. So when you create a goal for 2021, of course, like growth said, you want to race in the front, you want to be in the front, but you have to also be realistic, Williams isn’t gonna race at the top, at least not in 2020 21. So instead of making that their goal, they thought well, okay, what if we look back at 2020 reached q2 10 times, let’s try to at least have that same goal. So at least 10 times in qualifying to and maybe we can even go Get some points, score some points along the way or maybe get to q3. And well, we have had, we have seen the season and I think Williams did a very good, good job. They even got on the podium, the second place for George Russell Inspire. So
Sander Dur 10:18
I love this reaction, the emotions to it. That’s, that’s, that’s where you really can pinpoint than the high pressure environment that these guys really operate in what I see in my experience, and please correct me if you do not see this, large corporations seem to be suffering from a disease called tons. There’s always a next sprint, where the focus is not on what we should should be supposed to be doing right now for this coming sprint for the coming race. What would happen if scrum team or Formula One teams would treat every race like, Fuck it, there’s going to be another race. Let’s try again next time just like spilling over their work items to the next race.
Laurens Bonnema 10:56
I I totally agree. And I would like to add that most organizations make that even worse by instead of having as a vision, let’s win the next race or let’s get to the podium or let’s do let’s get this achievable objective next race. They have visions that are mostly financially motivated. In other words, let’s meet the target. And that is completely demotivating. I mean, for people that maybe have a stake in the game financially, so shareholders and stuff like that the owner lacks passion automatically. Yeah, I made some, I made some money there. But to really have the whole team jump out of bed and morning ready to get after it you need like a religion. So something that’s compelling, something that will make people want to do the best work of their lives. And I don’t think that a lot of companies really invest in creating those types of visions.
As Laila said, mostly, it’s not interesting or clear visions, which I guess if you look at Formula One teams, all the people who work in the in the teams are very passionate and very focused. And they all only have one goal for for that day or that weekend. And I think maybe we can learn a lot about that for organizations.
Sander Dur 12:12
How can they help? How can organizations help their Scrum teams create those? Those clear, crisp, concise, passionate goals?
Well have real sprint goals and product goals for a start? Right. So not let’s get to sprint, but let’s fix this thing in the product kind of Sprint’s are real goals, not output driven goals, but outcome driven goals. And that is, that is sadly not true in a lot of Scrum teams that we see in
Sander Dur 12:48
the wild. Yes. But indeed thats true, because what I see happening is there’s always work to do, right there are a million stakeholders in your organization’s and there will always be desires, there will always be wishes. So work is always there and present to be picked up a really focusing and honing in on what is the most valuable thing to pick up next, what is going to be the most valuable thing that we can potentially do to move ahead and win that championship? That’s really difficult to do. Why?
I think mostly it’s because we have too many, too many number one POS, if a team has 20 Number one POS, it’s hard, it’s hard to focus. And that also gives pressure to a team. So that I think when there’s a lot of pressure, there’s a little room for for passion and focus. And I think you really need those things to get the job done.
Hmm, that makes me think of a movie I saw. And I think COMMUNICATIONS TRAINING ones, where they had children, draw a clock and 60 seconds. And then you see really ugly clocks, the essence is drawn, but they’re not kind of fun. And then they give them 15 minutes to draw a clock and all kinds of creativity starts to emerge and the the clocks are embellished, and they’re beautiful. And they’re like a clock you would maybe even want to buy. The fun thing there is they allow those children attention to detail, attention to craftsmanship. And that is the second thing in our talk, which is we talked then about continuous integration, continuous delivery, because we relate most of what we do to IT teams. But in the essence it’s all about that what I just mentioned, it’s it’s craftsmanship and being allowed to deliver quality, then the work becomes motivating. The work becomes part of the reward. So you’re not just doing this for money. You’re not just doing this to output a lot of stuff. You’re doing this because what you’re doing is awesome. What you’re doing is something you really want to work on and that is in Formula One teams. That’s what why most people are their pay is usually not that great in a formula. wanting except maybe for the drivers. But for the people, all the other people working there, they don’t make millions, they get paid really normal salaries. And that is because the work itself so awesome that they don’t care about that because they’re in racing. And that’s their passion. That’s what they want to do in life.
Sander Dur 15:17
How many people do you encounter that are just working to pay their bills and nothing more, they’re just waiting for the clock to hit five and then run off?
Yeah, and, of course, that’s a choice. And if that’s your choice, then that’s awesome. There’s nothing wrong with it. I do my work because I want to create a world of work that we would want our kids to live in. Right. So that is something that really makes me want to jump out of bed in the morning. Plus, I want to work with people like Lila
Thank you, Lawrence. Likewise.
Sander Dur 15:55
What can we do to what can organizations do to really to help their people, their employees, focus on stuff that they’d like, because that’s the whole, the whole system looks like we are there. If you look, if I’m looking at my son in his elementary school, the focus is on getting the best grade, so he can go to the next class, or get it go to the to the best school hereafter, or go to the getting the best study so he can get the best job possible with the highest salary. The whole system is rigged. It doesn’t work, when you want to motivate people to do something that they want to do that they do because of passion. How can organizations help getting people back to what they read a lot.
I think it’s important to involve people in the process. I don’t know how it is with you guys. But often you see, there are something for a lot of work gets prepared for the teams, and we tell the teams, this is what we want. And this is how we want you to do it. And if you take away that creates creativity of the team. I think that’s I think that’s a waste.
And I think we also, we overestimate the wastefulness of so called gold plating, right, of being able to deliver ridiculous levels of quality. And we underestimate the level of motivation, and how that level of focus that you would need to be like a perfectionist in this will in the end actually also lead to a perfect process and therefore less waste. I love the movie, that is also shown in your in commerce presentation of what of the bolt that is needed for, for for Red Bull. Because that attend that level of attention to detail is in and of itself motivating, if you watch that, you want to be a become a bolt that that is portable. And that is passionate. Yeah, I’ll
Sander Dur 18:07
put the link in the show notes. But indeed, really honing in on the small details of every aspect rather than doing large chunks at once. Really fixing small incremental, incremental steps, ultimately adding up to a really large chunk. I mean, I can’t lose 20 kilos, just by the by the end of the next sprint, unfortunately, which would be nice. It’s just impossible. And yet, teams and organizations seem to be looking for such a silver bullet that’s going to help them lose their all their organizational waste in a single sprint, which is not going to happen.
Now, of course, it’s all kind of common sensical, because it is about attention to detail. And then being allowed to actually act on the details that you observe, in addition to being really focused on what are we doing it for, so really focused on the customer really focused on in Formula One, the driver and the sponsors, and also the viewers because those are three customers, so to speak. And then shortening the feedback loop there. So you can validate your assumptions, every race, as opposed to once every year or something.
Sander Dur 19:22
I think there’s there’s a, there’s an angle to that as well. In the episode with Marty Kagan, we were discussing how common sense has become so uncommon, there is not common sense anymore. The thing is with most of the teams that we work with, and that’s what I really enjoy about Formula One is that they are able to distill the stakeholder wasp nest and then the hive of stakeholders. Out of all the rest that’s going on. It’s not that the stakeholders are saying this is what you need to do. Now they’re figuring things out on their own on What they need to do, rather than just listening to the stakeholders? And I think that’s that’s happening way too often in the teams that we work with. How do you feel about that?
That’s a little bit Mex, honestly. Because I think in Formula One, if you look at the influence stakeholders, there are teams that have drivers because the stakeholders wanted that, right. So in true in our presentation,
we talk about the hash team, the only American hash team, the only markoma f1. Team on the on the grid. They lost their one of their biggest sponsors. I put it last year, it’s the 2020 last season. And they were in need of a new sponsor, and they found it in a Russian billionaire. But with the Russian billionaire also came his his son, as a rookie driver for the team.
Sander Dur 20:53
With an important note that he is an experienced driver by this point he has been in in it,
it took a couple of races, but it was not the most logical choice for for ruukki for the Formula One I I think, an F two in a championship, so yeah, yep. Yeah.
Sander Dur 21:16
Yeah. And there was there were quite some potentially image damaging incidents prior to the season start. And I’m being mild here. Where would you consider taking money over image damage?
Well, in this case, it was an obvious choice. Right. So do you want your team to exist? Still? Answer? Yes. Oh, that’s that case. And I like the thing he added right. So it’s not that he wasn’t a great driver? It is, he wasn’t a logical choice, because normally, you take them, one, maybe two, out Formula Two, not number five. So for that, you need money. But it’s not as if I have never driven a car before. Yeah, I want him in a Formula One car. What’s that? That’s just that’s not happening. Not even if you bring lots of dough, you have to be able to drive the car. But in this case, from the back of the grid instead of from the front of it, right? So of course, that’s also what kind of team we are. What I like is that all those teams, they are real teams, even if they’re huge, right? So in Agile, we have these notion that when you have worked together with lots of teams, you need big frameworks and lots of official sounding kind of meetings and then form the one. I think the top teams have, like 1000 people or maybe even more
shade is Red Bull 1000 Plus, so. Yep.
And they work as one team. Right. So and that nobody’s talking about scaling frameworks there.
Sander Dur 22:48
And that yet, we’re struggling here to do more than 15 people.
Yes. And that’s what we found fascinating, right? So you can if you’re really passionate about this, and if you just optimize for effectiveness, you can create 1000 person team, and they actually work as a team. Yeah.
Sander Dur 23:07
Why? What’s behind that? What, what is the thing that’s helping those teams really move forward as being such a group?
Oh, that’s a great Christian filmer. I think, I think that passion for the thing that you do, it plays a big role here.
And, of course, it flows naturally from looking at every detail, right? So for this detail, we want somebody to like really max out the awesome there. So let’s put a team on it. And then all those teams together, go into creating the best possible race results. And they all know that so they have a really strong focus on the end result, all of them. Nobody’s there wondering, why am I creating this Excel sheet?
That that this doesn’t happen in the Formula One team, and that’s what I like. And that’s actually the third point in our presentation where we talked about Extreme Ownership. Everybody there accept total responsibility, without fear of judgment, and that is, we have this nice, I love the quote from Rob Smedley, that we have in the in the talk when you have a blame culture, people spend like 60 to 90% of the effort covering what they’ve done, rather than doing anything positive, and understanding the problem making the cargo quicker or making operations slicker, and that that just sounds like truth.
Sander Dur 24:35
quicker and slicker. It’s a good theme for your sprint retrospective. How can we make our team quicker slicker? Rob Smedley is someone who really knows his stuff, who understands what he’s doing. And he’s also one of the geniuses behind the aerodynamic improvements for the coming season. So I appreciate you guys pulling his work out, as well. What brings us to the fourth point? Be in Lawrence looking at you?
Well, no excuses. I already mentioned that at the start, because that’s constraints fuel creativity. And when just when I said that Lila had immediately like 10 examples that had most people amazed what’s the nicest
talk about how the rules and regulations changed, for example, last season’s or the previous season, the 2021 season, which we just finished. We saw the season before, we saw a lot of problems with the tires. Pirelli had a lot of difficulty with the tires, we have a lot of blown up tires. So too, and they couldn’t they couldn’t fix the problem for its for the 2021 season. So they needed some help from the from the FIA. So they created new rules to make sure there was not so much downforce because the downforce may create the the tires blowing. But But you see, when they have those new regulations, you can see the creativity of the teams. And you know, when when such a rule is applied, you know, in the back of your head, it’s got to be a couple of races, and they will find the downforce again, that’s how those themes works. And I guess, Laila, she said something in the beginning of not not making a lot of fuss and not whining about the rules and regulation changes, but just take them as they are and trying to innovate or find your creativity to work around them and get back what you need it to be fast.
Laurens Bonnema 26:47
And yeah, and of course, it’s not that people, like all those rules, and all those changes, and yes, they do whine about them. But in the end, it’s not an acceptable excuse for losing a race. Right? So they still get after it and just roll with it. That’s what I like,
Sander Dur 27:03
no matter what people change, there will always be something who will complain about it?
Laurens Bonnema 27:07
Yes, yeah, of course, the universal complaint. That is actually a valid complaint almost in any organization, is complaining about bureaucracy. And that is the final thing that we point out in our, in our presentation and workshop. It’s that the speed is paramount. And sorry for that sound in between. Let me repeat that. No, bureaucracy, speed is paramount. That’s the main thing. And if your prime directive as a team is to get faster, you can’t waste any time on unnecessary bureaucracy that we have a nice example from, from Ferrari, where I think they like really overhaul
Laila Nouijeh 27:53
Ferraris. He wanted to streamline decision making regarding those processes in the bureaucracy, and the process is, so he got directly involved with the day to day work for the team centers always close. So if there’s a decision to make, you don’t have to contact him and wait for a couple of hours until he has the time to come around. But he’s always near the teams. And there were a lot of immediate changes to help speeding up those processes. The Boss, this
Laurens Bonnema 28:26
is yes, the boss. Yep, stepping into reduce bureaucracy. And that is, I think
Laila Nouijeh 28:31
that’s an important detail.
Laurens Bonnema 28:34
Yeah, it is. Management’s job, right, limit bureaucracy, so that we can be fast. Not just wait until teams complain that now is really slowing us down. Oh, just proactively step in and eliminate all the rules that we had in place in some point in time for a good reason. They’re no longer valid. So just ditch them.
Sander Dur 28:56
How does empowerment come to play?
Laurens Bonnema 29:04
Um, I don’t think that they talk about empowerment in Formula One teams. It’s just a fact of life. Right? So we all pitch in. We’re all. We all feel owner of the team and we all feel involved. So you don’t have to, like, empower anyone at all. I don’t think that’s empowered by default. Yeah, because what they’re doing what they’re passionate about, and that’s what the power comes from, so that they won’t let them. They you don’t have to really empower people there. I think the main thing you need to do something is to hold them back. How do you work all the time today?
Sander Dur 29:39
How, how beautiful would that idea be? For all the teams that we work with? When we step into an organization we do not have to have this discussion on having people or teams empowered, making the decision. They’re the ones calling the shots for the better of the product? How cool would that be? Cool? Yeah, work probably, but
Laurens Bonnema 30:01
not it’s what I that’s what I work for. Right. And of course, I’ve been working for that for the past 20 years. So fortunately, that doesn’t go so fast that I’m actually out of a job. But in all honesty, if that all of a sudden would become the new reality, and I would achieve my goal, if that being the norm, then I’m quite confident I probably find some other job that I love. And be very happy of having been a small part of making that successful.
Sander Dur 30:30
What would you be doing if you weren’t doing this?
Laurens Bonnema 30:34
I’d probably spend all my I would probably spend all day creating new.
Laila Nouijeh 30:38
Great answer, Lawrence. I think we would.
Sander Dur 30:45
Before I became too large to pour into fat, I always wanted to become a Formula One driver as well. That didn’t happen. Unfortunately, I still really liked what we’re doing here. Yeah. But how do we move forward? How can people take away your lessons your presentation and use it for their teams?
Laurens Bonnema 31:07
Well, it starts by getting us to talk about it, which of course, you can listen to this podcast. But also there are several versions of our talk online different meetups that we went to and of course, you can just invite us to
Laila Nouijeh 31:20
always happy to talk about this topic.
Laurens Bonnema 31:24
We talked about this I think in master classes at Union lover and then several conferences and so this is sort of our thing we really love to inspire people to to work along these lines. And of course, you can read the book but you’re a farmer who also has similar parallels there. And the mostly just find us online and chat because the main The wonderful thing I think also in the Agile community and how we got started as a community feel to it, and we’ll we’ll just share that knowledge
Sander Dur 31:59
where where can people find you?
Laurens Bonnema 32:02
I think that goes fastest through our social profiles. So mine is loud and bonobo on all the socials
Laila Nouijeh 32:09
I would mention mine because I have to spell it but I’m sure some of you will put it up somewhere
Sander Dur 32:18
Yes, I’ll include that in the show notes. Anyway, looking ahead into the coming season What’s your expectation? What are your hopes with this class Well,
Laila Nouijeh 32:29
I I hope that there’s gonna be a lot of competition I don’t like the dominance and and that doesn’t matter if it’s Mercedes or Red Bull. I don’t like watching one team right out and yeah, always just becoming one too. That’s not what I like about Formula One I like to see them hunt each other and yeah, that’s that’s what I wanted to see. So I don’t think that the whole field is coming together because they said they were gonna do some regulation rules or regulations, new rules regulations to make it possible for teams to to race each other more to to come together more but I am still a little bit skeptic about that. I think we’re gonna see a blue Ferrari and Mercedes on top. I think the midfield is going to come closer so maybe we could have some good fights in the midfield and we’re just going to watch the midfield but I don’t think they’re
Laurens Bonnema 33:37
right. Yeah, I think we’re gonna see three tiered very exciting racers and a three tiered I mean, fight in front fight in the middle fight in the back. And they’re real fights you can see lots of overtaking overtaking
Laila Nouijeh 33:49
Loris that was the word I was looking for real racing.
Sander Dur 33:57
I was watching a couple of clips from from races from, let’s say early noughties and beginning of the 2000 to 2004. And those battles were so close they were driving between one two tenths of a second just behind each other. And I think that’s that’s point that the Saudis hole Yeah, yeah, that depends who you ask because if people that are just started watching from the beginning of let’s say drive to survive, they’re used to it. I want screaming no headphones does not happening anymore.
Laila Nouijeh 34:35
The good old days well, sometimes we have Yeah, but everything. When you go to races, sometimes they have they have all kinds of shows around the racist and sometimes they have a race with with classical cars with with old Formula One cars and then when when you hear that sound again, we’ll goosebumps all over. Oh, wow.
Sander Dur 34:58
Yes. See? I went to the Formula One races on Ford in last September. And just prior to the Formula One race itself, you had the Porsche Supercup. And the Porsche Supercup, consists of 40 to 50, maxed out Porsches, they make so much more noise than the current Formula One, which also states that how high tech these foreign one engines are because the noisy stuff they’re really screaming is where the fee tends to be eight, fy 12. But they weren’t as efficient as the things that they do have now, because now it’s a 1.6 from the top of my head, that pushes out eight to 800,000 Horton brake horsepower, back then was 700 with with an eight, eight liter engine. So the efficiency there is amazing.
Laila Nouijeh 35:49
True, but also the sun does.
Laurens Bonnema 35:53
I think in the end, we will probably even see very exciting racing in electric cars. And actually, I know for a fact that
Laila Nouijeh 36:01
that’s sorry, guys I can work for but I’m sorry. I tried it a couple of times. But it’s it just isn’t my thing. Oh, no, not yet.
Sander Dur 36:10
It’s it’s the pushing of the boundary. And I think that’s also where Lawrence wants to go before we were dropped this tape.
Laurens Bonnema 36:20
Yeah, I know. I’m talking to some real petrolheads here. And of course, if you’re real petrolhead, you want to hear that like roaring engine. And I also kind of like that, I like me some American Muscle cars, for example. And that has nothing to do with being environmentally friendly at all. And they make a wonderful sound. And actually, I also like the sound of a real Ferrari engine, for example. However, as much as I like the sound, I know where this is headed. And I like the sheer torque of a really good electric engine. And if you look at the carbon wrap engines that Tesla is now creating and how fast they go. That is really ridiculous. And I think to be able to race one of the really fast as well as with the Roadster and then the new one that is coming that is actually faster than the Bugatti Veyron that that I would like to see race around the track, right. So not not the the ie the formula II that you see, because that is sort of boring, but really fast engines and then optimized for racing. And that is something that a friend of mine Joe justice is really working with now. He’s a race fanatic. He has its own cars. That’s what he became famous for like a Viki speed doing Scrum with creating, creating, like, essentially a kid car that was wrote legal that they that he could race in the mountains. And now he does that big time at Tesla, which is amazing.
Sander Dur 37:53
It’s funny to see because it dude has a Tesla with a huge foil around it that he installed himself. Yeah. It’s so common everywhere. Yeah, it seems you just moved to Hawaii, which seems to me to be the most illogical place when it comes to racing, because you don’t have
Laurens Bonnema 38:10
the race in the mountains. They’re like you wouldn’t believe really? Really? Yeah. I like we just live lots of nice turns. It’s like driving in Europe. But then on an island, that yes, you can sit on the beach.
Sander Dur 38:24
Yeah, exactly. I did. I do feel that there is a bit of more attractive factor to racing in a why compared to racing in this this Barloworld?
Laurens Bonnema 38:34
Sander Dur 38:36
But yeah, there is an incubation time. That’s That’s what I feel. Because they could switch to electric engines from right away from right now. But the spectated the stakeholder willingness to pay money for that is just not there yet. So that makes it really hard to switch even though it’s more
Laurens Bonnema 38:54
now but also like the the real innovation is done currently still in the petrol engines. And that’s where all the most of the money goes. And therefore, you see the most exciting racing there. I think what if, if they were to spend that amount of money on developing awesome electric racing cars, then I think it would see some really exciting racing really quickly.
Sander Dur 39:15
I don’t think there’s gonna take another 15 years before we get Yeah.
Laila Nouijeh 39:19
Speaker on it. Yeah.
Laurens Bonnema 39:20
I mean, it would just sound like push and that as amazing as it is. Does well make you feel nostalgic for young engines roar,
Sander Dur 39:32
but again, this is a generational thing. People who will just start watching when they have electrical engines will have no different pressures.
Laurens Bonnema 39:42
I don’t think so. I think that if you if you make people listen to like a good V 12 that that’s in and of itself a really rewarding sound.
Sander Dur 39:51
I do feel so but I’ve seen people that were like not, doesn’t mean doesn’t really do the thing for me.
Laurens Bonnema 39:58
They haven’t seen Lila Jump through him in a ditch
Sander Dur 40:01
afterwards. No, just Hey guys, I’m not going to take up any more of your time on the Friday afternoon. Again, I’ll include the show notes where people can find you the links to your new profiles, as well as to the clip of the bolt and your presentation. Thank you very much for being here for your willingness and for getting back from your dinner. Thanks
Laila Nouijeh 40:24
for having me. I really enjoyed it. Thank you.
Sander Dur 40:27
You have an amazing weekend, guys. As you may have noticed, we can continue talking about Formula One for days, especially with the new season being around the corner coming here in only 48 days. Looking forward to that very much. Now again, go to our Discord community, find us there, link in the show notes. Talk to us, interact with us. We really want to build a community that we can learn from each other develop. Not just with this podcast, it’s more about us really helping people grow. That’s my ultimate goal. Find find is there. Hope to talk to you there. I see you guys next
Welcoming Laurens and Laila
2021 Season recap
Goals and TANS
Money over image
Impact of bureaucracy
Contacting the guests
Looking ahead of the new season